Connell Barrett:

Welcome back to the how to get a girlfriend podcast. I'm your host, dating coach Connell Barrett. As always, here to help you flirt, gain confidence, and get a great girlfriend, and we're doing this all with authenticity, radical authenticity, not a bunch of weird toxic pickup moves or alpha male BS. And this is the 7th and final episode of this week's 7 episode relaunch. We've done 7 straight episodes of the how to get a girlfriend podcast, and we're gonna continue doing 2 episodes per week forever, pretty much till the end of time. But I thought a great way to finish the 7th straight episode in 7 days is to replay a fantastic episode I did with somebody I'm a really big fan of. Her name is Lindsey Metselaar. She's an influencer on Instagram.

Connell Barrett:

She is a dating expert. She hosts a kick ass podcast called We Met at Acme. And Lindsey and I have a great conversation that you're about to listen to where she's gonna tell you, here's what women want. Lindsay is formerly single herself, and she's also a dating expert, and she really knows how to read women, how to decode the signals that women might send you, things like how to figure out if a woman is into you or not, how to understand why a woman you're talking to and you think everything's going great, all of a sudden, she goes quiet or she gets somehow turned off. Lindsay is fantastic for these kinds of insights because she is a woman. She knows women. She used to be single. She hosts a fantastic dating podcast.

Connell Barrett:

So I think you're gonna get a lot out of this episode. And if I'm gonna give you the look. I hope you listened to the whole thing. It's 45 minutes of your time spent very well. But if you wanna go to 3 or 4 of my favorite parts, I would definitely go to the 20 minute mark of today's episode where Lindsay talks about her podcast, We Met at Acme, and how it helps millennials. So if you're of the millennial age, go to the 20 minute mark. She'll talk about how her podcast can help you out. And if you just wanna find out if a woman is into you, how to tell if a woman is or isn't into you, how to read those signals, the 29 and 29 minute and 52nd mark is a great place to go.

Connell Barrett:

And, here's a really good one. She talks about something at the 59 minute mark, she talks about something that guys do that they don't know they're doing that women absolutely hate when men do it. It's a very simple thing that you might have done on a date. Find out what it is. It's pretty simple, so easy to fix. That's at the 59 minute mark. And then at the very end, I asked Lindsay. I put her on the spot.

Connell Barrett:

I said, give me your top four dating tips. Lindsay Lindsay does this really cool thing on her Instagram, as we met at acme is her Instagram. And on her Instagram, she gives 4 tips everybody needs to know. So I asked her for 4 dating tips. So at the approximately the 1 hour and 1 minute mark, we end with Lindsay sharing 4 game changing dating tips that are gonna help you out. So if you wanna know what women want and how to better read women, Lindsay Metselaar has the answer. And, again, check out her Instagram, and definitely check out her podcast, we met at Acme. She's great, and this episode is really solid, and she was amazing in it.

Connell Barrett:

So enjoy it. So when I was approaching, I always wanted that sure thing, but there's just no certainties with approaching. You know? As the saying goes, nothing is certain except death, taxes, and sucky Adam Sandler movies. Alright. Welcome to the dating transformation podcast. I am your host, dating coach Connell Barrett. I'm here to help you gain confidence, learn to flirt, and attract an amazing girlfriend, and do this all with authenticity as your real best self, not a bunch of sketchy pickup artist nonsense. So welcome to the next episode.

Connell Barrett:

This is launch week. By the time you're done listening to this episode, you're gonna get some really awesome game changing tips about what women want about what women want. I've got an amazing guest. She's gonna give us game changing tips for actually, she's got about 10. Game changing tips for how to talk to women, how to text them on the apps, how to approach them, how not to approach them. So stick around for the whole episode because my guest, Lindsay Metselaar, is gonna give us some great tips and advice and I'm gonna jump in and join her. Okay. So today I wanna first tell you a story.

Connell Barrett:

I want to share with you something that really bothered me. Because if you're anything like me, and I think you probably are, you want to approach women out in the world. Right? You might see a woman at a bar or that really cute stunner in a yoga outfit who smiles at you sometimes at the gym. Or maybe you thought this was a big one for me. Maybe you're at a coffee shop, you're at a Starbucks, a park on a Saturday afternoon, and then you just see a woman sitting on a bench or she's waiting for her coffee at Starbucks, and she's just like 3 feet away from you. And you would love to break the ice with her, approach her, try to make some conversation happen and potentially get mutual attraction, get a date. But something holds you back. Right? You get in your head.

Connell Barrett:

You think, oh, I don't know what to say. Or if I approach her, it's gonna be weird and creepy. Or if I get shot down, these people are gonna see it, and it's gonna feel awkward and weird. And so very likely, you rarely or never approach women you find attractive, especially not in the daytime. Maybe you do it at night with a little bit of liquid courage. Doctor Jack Daniels can perform some short term miracles, but long term, alcohol is not the way to approach women. So I totally get how this feels. When I first was working on my dating life, I was basically exactly where you are.

Connell Barrett:

I did not approach. I doubted myself. I was afraid I thought it was weird and creepy to approach women or it might be seen that way. And here was the moment that really was the turning point for me where I decided, okay, I need to get some help. I'm gonna get some coaching. I'm gonna try to fix this somehow. I was at a Starbucks on a Sunday afternoon, in 2008. And I saw this really cute brunette sitting by herself on her phone drinking her chai latte.

Connell Barrett:

She's wearing a denim mini skirt. Really cute. My crush at the time was Katie Holmes, the actress Katie Holmes. She looked a lot like Katie Holmes. And I said, okay, Connell. You're finally gonna do it. You're gonna walk over there and approach this girl. Here you go.

Connell Barrett:

And, I walked over to her table and there was even a seat next to her. It was almost like an invitation to sit down. And I walked over and I made a beeline for her. And at the last minute, I took a detour and basically went to the men's room. And I thought, okay. I guess getting myself psyched up. Get psyched up. Go over to her.

Connell Barrett:

Get out of the men's room. Go back over to her. I walked to her table again and then I circled it once, maybe twice. And I wanted so badly to approach her, but it was like there was an invisible barrier. It was just like there was a force field around her. I couldn't do it. The thoughts that held me back were, oh, man. These people are gonna see me approach a girl.

Connell Barrett:

If she shoots me down, I'm gonna feel so fucking, creepy. I don't wanna be a creep. I'm a nice guy. I'm a nice boy from Ohio. I don't wanna creep out a girl. I don't wanna get shot down. And, basically, I circled her. I circled her chair for about, I don't know, off and on for about 2 or 3 minutes. And I was kinda like a frightened shark circling but too afraid to bite, quote, unquote.

Connell Barrett:

Anyway, I couldn't get the courage up. And finally, after a few minutes, I go back to my seat and I see her walk up and she just walks out. And I watch her walk away on Park Avenue in 29th Street in Manhattan. And I remember thinking, damn it. What's wrong with you? Why can't you approach a girl? And I remember also thinking, there goes another really cool, potentially awesome, intelligent, fun, definitely beautiful woman who could have been in my life. I could have had a date with her maybe. Who knows? Maybe she would have become my girlfriend. If nothing else, I could have just stepped up and taken an action, but I didn't do it.

Connell Barrett:

And I felt like I couldn't do it. And I sat down and I grabbed a pen. I had a pen with me and I started writing on a Starbucks napkin. You suck. You suck. You suck. And that was when I was really upset at myself. And that's when I went online and found the guy who became my first coach.

Connell Barrett:

Anyway, the lesson here or the kind of the takeaway I wanna share with you is, if you are first of all, just know that you don't suck. I wrote a book called Dating Sucks But You Don't. And the message here of this book among the messages is, hey, man. If you can't approach women, it's not that you suck. It's that dating is hard. It's that approaching can feel very challenging and very scary, but you don't suck. Dating can definitely suck, but you don't. You're awesome.

Connell Barrett:

And I had lost a sense of my awesomeness at that time, and I just could not approach women. So I needed help from a coach. You may not need a coach. I wanna give you a tip right now that you can take out into the world and use it today. That'll make it so much easier to step up to break the ice with that attractive woman who you see at a bar, at the gym, at Starbucks, wherever you might be. Here's what I wish I had known back in 2,008. Basically, it's a mindset fix and it's a practical tip. I could not approach that woman because I thought number 1, it's creepy and weird to hit on girls.

Connell Barrett:

And also, I literally didn't know what to say. I literally had no idea what the right thing to say was. So here's a 2 part tip. Tip number 1 is I want you to give yourself permission and remind yourself that it's true. Women don't want every man approaching them, but they definitely want a high value awesome man with a lot to offer to chat with them. And do you have to get in touch with what you offer? You have to get a sense of, hey, I have some really great things about myself. Whatever they may be.

Connell Barrett:

Right? I have this hobby. I have a full time job. I'm a good cook. I love to travel. I'm fit. I'm at the gym all the time. You gotta remind yourself that women do want men of value to break the ice with them in a charming way. So they don't wanna get hit on per se, but they do want a high value man like you to break the ice and make her smile.

Connell Barrett:

So I was so worried that day about being creepy, hitting on her, getting blown out. It was a mindset issue. Remind yourself, it's okay to approach. You're not hitting on her. You're breaking the ice. You're giving her a small gift. The gift of a short, authentic, brief, positive interaction. And women love that.

Connell Barrett:

Women love that. So tip number 1 is just give yourself permission. I'm not hitting on the girl. I'm giving her something of value, a moment with me. And the second tip is what to say. Right? You might not know what to say. Here's the great way to always know what to say. Look at the woman you want to chat with and notice something about her that's not looks related that you like and appreciate.

Connell Barrett:

So don't make it about or at least don't make it about her physical features. Okay? It can be a compliment on her look, her style. But don't make it about her lips, her body, her ton a, obviously. Here's a great way to approach. Compliment something that you appreciate. For example, if I could go back in time to that girl in the Starbucks, I would say, hey, excuse me, miss. I just wanna say that you have great style. You're really put together and you have awesome style.

Connell Barrett:

That's not hitting on a girl. That's just giving a genuine compliment about her cool denim skirt and maybe she I forget it's been so long. But let's say she was wearing cool pink Chuck Taylor sneakers. Excuse me, miss. I love your style. Great sneakers, awesome denim, miniskirt, you got it going on. Then let her respond to that. There's something about an authentic, specific, well intentioned compliment that 9 out of 10 women will take very well.

Connell Barrett:

They'll appreciate it. And then you've broken the ice. You've done the hardest thing. You've said something to a woman with good intentions, and then she'll take it in. And then in terms of what to say next, we'll go into that on a different podcast. But think of it as a compliment, think of a compliment as a small gift. You're not out in the world trying to take from women. You're not trying to get phone numbers.

Connell Barrett:

You're not trying to get attraction. You're not trying to get sex. I mean, not at first. Eventually, we want those things in a win-win way. But if you wanna get rid of approaching anxiety today, make it about I'm gonna give genuine, sincere, real compliments to women without agenda and then let those compliments land and see how she responds. If she smiles and says, oh my god. Thank you so much. You noticed my awesome leather jacket.

Connell Barrett:

I appreciate that. Who knows? She might ask you a question or compliment you back. And now you're talking to a really pretty girl who you just approached and that's when good things can happen. But even if she doesn't go further than the compliment and she accepts the compliment, I promise you, you feel so much better by taking that action. You feel amazing about yourself as a man. By being on that true authentic path and approaching women from a place of good, courageous, authentic intention. I hope that makes sense. Yeah.

Connell Barrett:

Don't do what I do. Don't circle her chair for 5 minutes like a creepy little scared shark. And don't write you suck on a napkin. Life's too short to feel that way about yourself. Okay. That was my little opening gambit for you here today. Stick around. We're gonna talk to Lindsey Metzelaar.

Connell Barrett:

Lindsey, you're gonna love Lindsey. Lindsey Lindsey is a dating expert and an influencer. She's also a very experienced dater. She's married now. She's gonna give you the view from the inside. What do women want? How do we text them? How do you approach them from her point of view? You're gonna get so many great tips from Lindsay. You're gonna love this conversation. Stick around.

Connell Barrett:

I'll be right back with Lindsay Metselaar.

Lindsey Metselaar:

I'm gonna read your mind. Ready? I'll bet that you would love to confidently approach women. Get great matches on the dating apps, flirt with charm, and attract your dream girlfriend. Right? But fear keeps you from approaching. You're not sure how to flirt. You struggle on the apps, and desirable women just don't seem into you. Well, I have great news. Dating coach, Connell Barrett, can help.

Lindsey Metselaar:

He's guided thousands of men like you to more confidence and help them attract their dream girlfriends. So book a free strategy call today to see if Connell's coaching is right for you. On your call, Connell or a team member will give you personalized advice to help you have more confidence, more dates, and more fun. Oh, and you'll be dating women as your best self, a charming gentleman. That's because Connell does not teach creepy pickup artist tricks. He unlocks your most confident self so you can make authentic romantic connections. Your next steps? Book your free call today at dating transformation.comforward/contact and grab a time that works for you. Then you'll be on your way to more confidence, better results, and attracting bright, beautiful women.

Lindsey Metselaar:

Oh, so you know, soon Connell will stop taking on new clients. So book a call today while you still can. Go to dating transformation.comforward/contact and transform your love life. Bye.

Connell Barrett:

And we're back with Lindsay Metselaar. I'm super psyched to have Lindsay here. Lindsay is a native New Yorker, and she hosts a podcast called We Met at Acme, which is a popular, and I can verify an awesome millennial dating podcast. I know because I was on it even though I'm way too old to be even close to a millennial. We Met at Acme is also a brand about all things dating from live events, mixers, retreats, and more stuff that I'm sure we're gonna get into. And, plus, I'm just a huge fan of Lindsay's Instagram where you can get a lot of really great practical quick dating tips. She does this really cool thing where she gives tips in fours, which I love, like, four mistakes not to make on first dates and the like. And her Instagram is when we met at acme.

Connell Barrett:

Get ready because Lindsay is a dating advice machine, and I'm super stoked to have her here today. Lindsay, welcome to launch a week here at a dating transformation podcast.

Lindsey Metselaar:

I am honored to be here. Thank you for having me.

Connell Barrett:

Your resume is so long. We have no more time for questions. But,

Lindsey Metselaar:

let's pack it up then.

Connell Barrett:

But thanks for stopping by. Cool. Let's start, let's get right to it. Let's talk about what we met at ACME. I'm sure you get this a lot, so pardon the cliched question, but what does the name mean? Where did it come from? And, of course, what is the core mission? What's the core message of We Met at Acme?

Lindsey Metselaar:

The name came because I was very single at the time of starting my podcast and I was frequenting ACME, which is a club in the city. And I had met some people there and I knew some people that met there and it just kind of rolled off the tongue and sounded really, really nice. And the second part of the question reminded me again.

Connell Barrett:

Well, you're your main mission here, you primarily talk to millennials as I understand it. Yeah. What's the core mission? What's the core message?

Lindsey Metselaar:

I do talk to millennials. The core message is really I'm trying to be like a big sister character to a lot of people in the dating world. And the message is like you are amazing, you know your self worth and date like you are the shit basically. Dates like it's about you choosing them not them choosing you and here are some ways to make dating not as stressful and that's when the rules come in.

Connell Barrett:

Alright. I don't know if you ever wanna write a book, but that's not a bad working title. It's a date like you're the shit. Instead of the the fuck trope, maybe you'll start the the shit. You're the shit trope.

Lindsey Metselaar:

The shit tropes. The shit's coming back. Bring back the shits.

Connell Barrett:

Tell us a little bit more about your origin story, whether it's meeting people at Acme or even before then. I'm fascinated by how people go from doubtful, struggling, lack of confidence to finding the one. You're happily married. You've obviously done something very right. But can you talk a little bit about your origin story, maybe when you weren't a dating expert or didn't have, kind of a handle on how to do this in a way that's really effective?

Lindsey Metselaar:

Yeah. Well, what's funny is that I always thought that I was an expert. Right? Like, I was that overconfident from the beginning where I thought that I was doing everything right all the time until I was really badly dumped. And it was kind of like a wake up call where I was like, oh my god, you know, I'm not doing the right things or I'm not as good as I think I am. And the reason I thought I was good was because I was always great at helping friends text and, like, the banter stuff. That was, like, something I was confident about that I knew what I was doing. But when it came to, like, I could get people to date me. Right? But then when it came to, like, long lasting relationships, it was a little bit harder.

Lindsey Metselaar:

And so I had a friend come over and we were just kinda talking about our dating life. And I was like this 5 years ago. And I was like, why don't we just record this conversation? There is no podcast out there that's about dating right now. It's like news and crime. And I feel like other people can relate to this chaos that is dating, especially in New York City, but as a millennial. Mhmm. And so we just recorded it and we released it. And the rest is history.

Connell Barrett:

Tell me a bit more about what it's like dating as a millennial now or then. Bay basically, what do millennials have to take under consideration, deal with, endure versus other generations? I'm Gen X, and there's people who are younger now than millennials. What is it about millennials that makes them differentiate from others?

Lindsey Metselaar:

Millennials have so many different mediums when it comes to dating. It is all of these different ways to communicate. So Snapchat, Instagram, TikTok, Pinterest, Venmo, like anything is a dating app to millennials. And so it gets really complicated. Like we're overstimulated. We just have too many different modes of communication that often we're not communicating at all as millennials and with the dating apps, which everyone has, I guess every generation has, but we get really desensitized to just like swiping and swiping and swiping. And so I think it's just between communication struggles and having too many options. As a millennial dater, it can be really hard to sift through the noise and actually stick with something.

Connell Barrett:

So when one of my male clients says, oh, Connell, I've got all these matches, but every time I ask a woman out, she finds a reason not to go. Or or maybe she goes quiet. Even though things are going well, she goes quiet. Can that be because people have so many dating options today?

Lindsey Metselaar:

That could be. It also could be because women are so complicated and so confusing. And I, like, will talk to women about their dating lives, they'll be like I just don't understand like this person will talk to me forever and not ask me out but then when somebody asks them out like right away they're like oh my god he asked me out right away and so I think it's just finding like a happy medium between the 2. I'd imagine in that situation, the woman was just like, oh my god. It was, like, too much too soon. You know?

Connell Barrett:

Yeah. Okay. We're gonna get back to texting for sure because my listener right now is literally sitting on the edge of his seat because you're a woman and you're an expert and you have been single and there's something about a woman giving men advice that means so much to them. I took my girlfriend out with me once doing infield coaching with my clients where we go out on the town for the weekend, And their focus all shifted away from me, and they were just like, and then what do I text next? And what do women want? So you're like an MVP here. So we'll come back to the texting help. But I just wanna maybe share some fun stories about your dating past. One of my favorite tips for men is a fun question to ask early on a first date is asking a woman for any funny dating horror story she has, because it starts things out in a fun, light place. And, also, it kinda makes him hopefully look cooler than whatever loser guy she's talking about.

Connell Barrett:

So let me ask you. Do you have any fun, memorable first date horror stories that from back in the day, back in

Lindsey Metselaar:

the scene of this? I never was that good at this answer because I got decently lucky. I mean, I had one date that was just really mean. He told me that I sounded like a farmer, which, like, I guess he meant as an insult. Like and I didn't really know how to respond to that. And that was just a weird experience. And then I had so I had, like, the mean guys. And then I've had the guys who are just, like, it's pulling teeth to have a conversation with. And it's so funny.

Lindsey Metselaar:

It's always those guys that it's pulling teeth to have a conversation with that asks you on a second date. And you're like, were we on the same date? Like, were we and I wonder I bet you it's the same for reverse. Meaning, like, if a guy feels like he's pulling teeth on a date, maybe the girl thinks that it went well. You know what I mean?

Connell Barrett:

Right. Interesting. I went by the way back to the farmer, the guy who called you a farmer. Do you think there might have been he might have been doing a quote unquote nag where he's like teasing the girl, trying to make her feel insecure?

Lindsey Metselaar:

It's possible, but I don't think nagging works in any nagging came from a place of I feel like it was created from a place of insecurity. Just like this person is doing so well. They think they're so cool. So let's, like, knock them down a peg and see if it works. Negging only worked once for me in college. But, again, I was in college, so that's probably why.

Connell Barrett:

It worked on you or you did it?

Lindsey Metselaar:

No. It worked on me. Someone did it to me.

Connell Barrett:

Do you remember what it was? What he said?

Lindsey Metselaar:

A guy came up to me who I later ended up dating, and he said, your legs are so hairy. That's definitely and it was an insult.

Connell Barrett:

That's not a negative. It's just an insult.

Lindsey Metselaar:

And by the way, he had no idea if they were or not. He was just saying that. And my legs were hairy. I don't really shave my legs, but I'm not like a hairy person. They just like peach fuzz. But I was like, what? Like, how do you know? You know? And it normally does not work.

Connell Barrett:

I hate it when guys steal my lines because I invented your legs are hairy. That's really annoying. I get no credit for that. I gotta start copywriting my best no. I never like negs. You totally nailed it. Negs come from this place of, well, she must be above me, so I gotta find a way to bring her down to my level, which even if it worked, it's, like, gross. But it's coming from such a bad place, hey.

Connell Barrett:

Why don't you just lift yourself up and make yourself as authentically, vulnerably awesome as you can be and see if you guys genuinely connect? That's way more effective.

Lindsey Metselaar:

Totally. Way more.

Connell Barrett:

Okay. A couple more dating questions for you. I actually went to your website the other day, and I saw one tip, like, on the home page, so it must be an important tip. A little piece of wisdom that reads, if you're confused, they're not interested. Yep. Can you elaborate on what that means?

Lindsey Metselaar:

So what that means is that if and this is more, like, towards women dating men. It's like if you're but still for men too. If you're confused about how they feel about you, like they're hot and cold or you're still trying to figure it out, screenshot the conversation, send it to friends. Do you think they like me? You know, like waiting on their every last word to try to figure it out. Like it's like it's like that meme with like the math problem on the board like do they like me? They don't because you wouldn't be confused if somebody did like you. If somebody if somebody showed up consistently made plans with you messaged you you know every day when you're dating and and whatnot. That's what that really means. And that, like, would have saved me so much time when dating in my twenties if I knew that.

Connell Barrett:

Okay. Alright. So there's a little bit of tough love there. It's like, hey. If you're confused, the truth is they're not interested. They're not that into you.

Lindsey Metselaar:

Right. Like, if you're asking a friend, if you're like, oh, maybe he, you know, maybe he turned his phone off for the weekend. No.

Connell Barrett:

Yeah. Okay. Well, again, as a formerly single eligible woman, what are some signs that a woman either is or isn't interested in a guy so he can get clarity on whether she's probably into it or probably not?

Lindsey Metselaar:

Yeah. I think I will say that it's harder, especially if it's a woman who follows women's acting and dating rules because we don't necessarily put all of our cards on the table right away.

Connell Barrett:

Okay.

Lindsey Metselaar:

But if a woman answers your text in, like, a timely manner, if she's continuing to get excited when you suggest going out on dates and she kisses you and, you know, smiles and laughs at your jokes and likes to banter with you and enjoys, like, talking every day and you have, like, kind of these inside jokes. Like, those are all signs that a woman is interested in you. I think that with women we are more clear when we're not interested than men. We will usually send what I call an anti ghost text which is like you know it's been great getting to know you, I didn't feel a connection blah blah blah.

Connell Barrett:

Okay.

Lindsey Metselaar:

I feel and I could be wrong but most of the women that I know aren't big on like the leading guys for no reason. And like we're human just like we would feel bad if we were taken on multiple nice dinner dates and still weren't interested. We'd probably cut it off after a while. So I think that if a woman's interested she's continuing to go out with you there's kissing maybe a little bit more as we get to know each other, texting and if a woman's not interested in you then she's not responding to your messages.

Connell Barrett:

Right.

Lindsey Metselaar:

She's, you know, continuing to reschedule, prioritizing other things. But what can be complicated from a man's perspective is, like, if you are the kind of guy who's not planning these dates ahead, who's sending that, like, last minute text that's like, oh, like, some like, are you free now? And then you're like, but she's not going out with me. Then that's on you. Then she would be interested in you if you, like, got your shit together.

Connell Barrett:

Yeah. For me, and tell me if you

Lindsey Metselaar:

Yeah.

Connell Barrett:

Agree or not, I tell my clients, is she talking to you? Is she responsive? Is there some good energy? Or there's some emojis going both ways. And maybe she can't meet up with you right away, but if she's still responsive and there's a good vibe, she might just be a really popular, busy person who is open to it. So I say, don't give up. Be persistent, but empathetic, and stay charming, as charming as you can. I dated a woman a couple years ago, and I even sent this text exchange to my clients. It's about 6 weeks of texting from her and she and myself matching our first date. I must have asked her 4 or 5 times, asked her out. And every time she couldn't go, but she had a good reason and she was still responsive.

Connell Barrett:

And she was , the tennis ball was going back and forth. So I stayed persistent and we did end up meeting up and going out. But if she had just gone totally quiet, then I would have just been a creepy stalker if I'd have kept asking her out. Right?

Lindsey Metselaar:

Totally. And I love that you did that and that you stayed with it. And I think that's the one double standard that that's one of the double standards that men can get away with is that persistence. And like if I were coaching women, I would be like, you know, if he's interested, he's gonna wanna go out with you. But for women, I think a lot of the time we hear these stories of like, oh, I wasn't like, oh, I was like, you know, still have feelings for my ex or I was doing dealing with this, but, like, he kept texting me and, like, showing that he was interested in me and then, like, it aligned and worked out. You don't often hear that the other way around.

Connell Barrett:

Right. Okay. So let's switch to the topic of vulnerability and dating. I feel one of the things I really like about your podcast is how real and vulnerable you and your guests are. You have an episode. I know that it was a tongue in cheek title, but you had an episode that really caught my eye after reading its title, so I almost got divorced 2 weeks ago. And you didn't really get divorced, but it was still a real vulnerable thing to write and to talk about on your podcast, this fight you had with your husband. And I thought, what do you do? What's your view on how vulnerable and real to be on dates, those first few dates, those first few weeks of texting and getting to know somebody? Can you be too vulnerable, and can you be too walled off and not vulnerable enough? What are your thoughts on the topic of vulnerability and dating?

Lindsey Metselaar:

Vulnerability is crucial when dating. I think that it's definitely a dance in terms of, like, when you start to be vulnerable. I would say, like, dates 1 to 3 you like do like a tiny dive into vulnerability and then after the 3rd date is when you get a little bit deeper. And but you could sprinkle it in here and that here and there. Like, for example, I think that it's really great to talk about your past relationships on the first few dates. Not not like extensively, but more so just like why well, like, how come your last relationship ended? What did you like to take away from it? What's your blind spot when it comes to dating that you're trying to be better at in relationships? I think that just that curiosity is crucial and that curiosity creates vulnerability. So that kind of vulnerability is good. I think if you have a family trauma, which we all do, I would probably save that for like the 4 or or after.

Lindsey Metselaar:

But again like going back to the sprinkling like if you're in therapy and you think that that's a big part of your life and has shaped you then talk about that in dates 1, 2, 3. I think that that's like showing the power of vulnerability if you're able to, you know, talk about that stuff in a positive way. But just don't bring the energy down with your vulnerability. Right. Does that make sense?

Connell Barrett:

Yes. Because a woman might view that. Well, if a man was if a man has opened up about something vulnerable, but the energy diminished

Lindsey Metselaar:

Mhmm.

Connell Barrett:

How might a woman take that or how might that hurt the date?

Lindsey Metselaar:

I think that everybody when they're dating is looking for somebody to bring lightness and, like, good energy into their lives and levity. And when we kind of dump our shit onto the date it can be indicative of how that relationship is gonna go. Like, oh, this person's gonna be complaining or this person's gonna bring me down. And so it's not like don't be yourself. If you have that part of you, that's that's okay. But it's more like lead with your good foot or the best foot forward. And so, like, for example, with the therapy thing, like, I might bring it up to say or, like, if I were a guy, I'd bring it up to say, like, therapy has been so amazing for me. It made me realize, like, that my career wasn't the best for me.

Lindsey Metselaar:

Now I'm in this great career as opposed to being, like, therapy made me realize that, like, I really struggled as a kid and, like, I'm and, like, dating has been really hard for me. Like, it's just like you wanna just bring that positivity into the date because people are expecting to leave in a good mood from a date, not like being brought down.

Connell Barrett:

Right. And my dog died last week, and my boss was mean to me, and I'm behind on my rant. So can I see you again next week?

Lindsey Metselaar:

Exactly.

Connell Barrett:

It's not gonna happen.

Lindsey Metselaar:

Rejection, ghosting, loneliness, lack of dates, and lack of confidence. For many men, dating just sucks, but it doesn't have to. There's a simple yet powerful way to gain instant confidence and attract a great girlfriend. Be radically authentic. It's all laid out in the number one Amazon bestselling book. Dating sucks, but you don't. Your step by step guide to attracting wonderful women and doing it with total authenticity. Author and dating coach, Connell Barrett, has had and fixed all the dating problems that you struggle with.

Lindsey Metselaar:

He's also helped thousands of men gain confidence and find love. He's put his best tips and strategies into dating sucks, but you don't so that you can confidently approach women and get dates. Become magnetic and attractive, even if you're not tall or great looking. Always know what to say to make sparks fly. Get lots of great matches and dates on the dating apps, and attract your dream woman. You can find Dating Sucks, but you don't on Amazon or wherever books are sold in paperback, Kindle, and audiobook. Get Dating Sucks, but you don't today to transform your confidence and find your dream girl.

Connell Barrett:

Yeah. One of the quotes from my book that I've dropped every now and then is be on a date, be an open book, not an open wound. Vulnerable, authentic, which is my whole thing. You can be anything. Anything can be too much of that thing

Lindsey Metselaar:

Yeah.

Connell Barrett:

Or or delivered with the wrong energy. I remember on my first date with my now girlfriend, Jess, I remember it somehow the topic of past relationship relationships came up, and I talked about I told a story, 2 or 3 minute story about my 9 week marriage

Lindsey Metselaar:

Yeah.

Connell Barrett:

And how I felt rejected by all women, and it set me off on this path. And it sounds the topic might not sound like that textbook dating topic, but it was really through the lens of, look how I learned so much from it. I've grown. My ex and I are fine, and it's not gonna bring the date down. As long as to your point, you're not the energy, it's not about negativity. It's about, oh, hey. This was tough for me, but, man, I'm glad I went through it because now I'm a better person. Like, that's a good frame.

Lindsey Metselaar:

Yeah. Focusing on the lesson, focusing on the takeaway is amazing.

Connell Barrett:

And then what I think is cool about that, not in a manipulative way, but just in a way of human connection is just kinda letting this person show, not telling this person, but showing this person that, hey. That's who I was then, and look at this awesome guy you see before you now. Not me, Connell. I mean, who yeah. Whoever's listening to this. Yeah. I made mistakes. I'm human.

Connell Barrett:

I'm flawed, but I've learned from them. And here I am, and we're all just trying to do our best. And I think that kind of vulnerability can be very attractive compared to the guy who's, like, trying to use cool lines and nagging and acting all cool and bored, and that just never worked for me. Plus, it just felt gross.

Lindsey Metselaar:

Exactly. Yeah. No. I think that's great. And, like, vulnerability shows maturity and shows that, like, you are ready to find that connection.

Connell Barrett:

You had a great conversation with Jordana Abraham about vulnerability on your podcast a while back. And she said something. She had this great quote that I wanted to ask you about. She said she was talking about flirting or or just about romantic connection versus not versus disconnecting. Yeah. And she said I'm paraphrasing now. I think she said, logic is the opposite of romance. And I believe you were talking about relationships, but when she said that, I thought, oh my gosh.

Connell Barrett:

So many men go out on first dates, and they speak very logically about facts, figures. This is my IT job. Here are some dates and information. And the conversation might flow, quote, unquote, but there's not, like, the romance, the fun, the emotion tied to it. If, again, as a formerly single woman, what's your take on the idea of being too logical and informational versus versus more romantic, more, you know, emotionally connected in the way you communicate on a date? I think most men lean towards logic. And

Lindsey Metselaar:

Yeah. I forgot where I was when I learned this, but oh, wait. I remember. I was in, some sort of, like, WeWork seminar a long time ago and we were being taught about listening and how men listen and how women listen. And it was like men usually listen to fix the problem. Whereas men are sorry, whereas women listen to be empathetic towards the problem and like to hear you and Right. You know, commiserate or whatnot. And that kind of relates to dating.

Lindsey Metselaar:

It's like men lean towards what makes sense and women tend to lean towards like what am I feeling about this? And I think that both men and women need to take a page from the other person's book. And so men, I think, need to stop being as logical when it comes to dating. And I actually just had a situation like this. I do like this, ask me anything on Fridays on my Instagram. And someone had asked me how Steven, how my husband knew I was the one and when. And I asked him to answer for me. I was like, send me, like, a little blurb of, you know, how you knew I was the one and I will share it. And I'm actually gonna pull it up because he was so logical in his first answer that I was like, I I I'm I was like cringing from it.

Lindsey Metselaar:

I was like, you need to try again. Right? His first answer was, I wouldn't say it hit me in a single moment. It was more of a series of moments together over a period of time. With each stage of our relationship, my affection for you grew to a place where I loved you an insane amount and I knew I'd found a partner with whom I could squeeze the most out of life. Maybe it was a weird combination of adoration and optimism that was something I hadn't felt slash how I knew. I was like, listen, that is so sweet, but there's like no that's so robotic. I was like, there's no, like, emotion in there. Try again.

Connell Barrett:

Try again, honey.

Lindsey Metselaar:

And he did it again. And he said, and this is so much better, but I'm curious what you think. He said, I was just crazy about you. You were everything I wanted in a partner. There were ups and downs, but the highs were insane and always worth it. I wanted to experience that as long as I could. Like, how much better is that when he leaned into his emotions versus like typing out some sort of first we moved in together then I felt it was the next step. You know what I mean?

Connell Barrett:

Right. It had more feeling, had more soul. Totally. And I tell men like you don't need to worry about the information, the logic. There'll be plenty of facts and figures in what you say. Try to tap in more into that more soulful expression.

Lindsey Metselaar:

Yes.

Connell Barrett:

And there's little quick tips to do that. You can just start sentences. This is what my coaches taught me 10 plus years ago, because I'm so analytical. I will go down the deepest analytical logical rabbit hole with you if you want, but I know that's just not gonna help my dating life or my love life. So just things like starting off sentences by saying I feel. Here's how I feel about that. Or playing as an improv game I love called love hate, where you have to really love things or really hate things. And it's helped a lot of my clients just say, oh my god.

Connell Barrett:

I love that you're into Coldplay. I love that you went to Harvard. How'd that feel when you went to Harvard? What your favorite movie is, I don't know, Casablanca. I hate that movie. Whatever it is. At least you're injecting some emotion. You're creating some energy that can create some kind of polarity as opposed to 2 people talking about logical things, which is the opposite of romance as Jordana said, which I really liked.

Lindsey Metselaar:

Totally.

Connell Barrett:

I can't let you go without talking about texting. I hear so the guy listening to this is like, what do I text? What's the secret? What do women want from texting? Yeah. What do you get? Got any tips, any guidelines, do's and don'ts about how to text in that courtship dating phase of getting to know somebody?

Lindsey Metselaar:

Well, I think that if you want to continue seeing someone and ultimately date them, you need to be texting consistently. You need to text at least once a day. And you need to be the man of the situation initiating most of those texts. And if you like you shouldn't be afraid to do that if you're getting a good response every time. It's very much like just setting the pace for the relationship and you're courting this person and so you should be sending those texts. You should by this you know whatever stage you're dating you should have good banter with one another, inside jokes, you should not ask for nudes. I think that's a given. Okay.

Lindsey Metselaar:

Don't send any unsolicited pictures. But being, you know, switching up the conversation, sending like different things like a meme or a funny TikTok or, you know, asking her about her day, following up when she says she has a big presentation the next day. How did the presentation go? You know, thoughtful texts that really show that you care and make her smile and make her day, but not too much like good morning, beautiful, good night, angel. You know, it doesn't need to be like that as much as it's just like bringing that fun conversation into her dad.

Connell Barrett:

Just when you said that, I got chills.

Lindsey Metselaar:

Yeah.

Connell Barrett:

Did the hair on your hairy legs stand up when you

Lindsey Metselaar:

Oh, yeah. Said that?

Connell Barrett:

Was it

Lindsey Metselaar:

It's just sandy.

Connell Barrett:

Hey hey, Angel. Oh, I once had a client by the way, this was years ago. He's now a proud dad with his new partner, and I like to think that I helped that baby come into the world. But, after one date with a woman, he sent me this long poem he was gonna send her, like a love poem No. About the 2 of them in a boat on a pond and, like, leaves. And I was like, do not send that message, sir. Never.

Lindsey Metselaar:

Never. It's so funny because it's never a good idea to send, like, some long winded paragraph to anyone you're seeing ever. It's just never a good idea. Like, you save that stuff in person always. And that's another texting tip. It's, like, keep it fun, keep it light. Like, if you have to call them out for something or if you wanna have, like, believe me, my girlfriend's conversation or I like you type of thing, like, do it in person, always in person.

Connell Barrett:

Oh, yeah. And when in doubt, do something in person if you can. If you can. Definitely. Okay. So I have a little game I wanna play. So one of my favorite things to do in dating was bring a couple fun games on a date, and I've been doing this on the pod. So because you're obviously a woman and dating expert, I thought we play a little game called what women want and what women don't want since you can obviously speak for women, I think, pretty damn well.

Connell Barrett:

So I'm gonna name a dating category. And if you would, just share with us, oh, here's what women want. Here's what they don't want. Cool. Is that cool?

Lindsey Metselaar:

Yeah. I love it.

Connell Barrett:

Okay. Let's do it. Topic number 1 or category 1 is first date topics. What do women wanna talk about? What do they not wanna talk about?

Lindsey Metselaar:

They wanna talk about who you are and who you were and who you plan to be in the future.

Connell Barrett:

Oh. That's right.

Lindsey Metselaar:

And they don't wanna talk about why your ex is a bitch and how much money your car costs.

Connell Barrett:

Why? I know I think I know the answer to that.

Lindsey Metselaar:

And, like, drugs that you do.

Connell Barrett:

Oh, shoot. No wonder I had so much trouble back then. Actually, back to an earlier topic, first date horror stories. A woman I was on a first date with, I asked her that question. What's your worst first date ever? She said, well, a guy once had his cocaine dealer who showed up on the date and gave him a delivery.

Lindsey Metselaar:

I've heard that story, like, happened to someone else. Maybe it's the same guy.

Connell Barrett:

He must be out there. Okay. I loved your answer there because you said tell her not just who you were and are, but also who you are becoming, who you're gonna be. Can you elaborate on that? Because that was really interesting.

Lindsey Metselaar:

Yeah. I think it's like the modern answer to, like, where do you see yourself in 5 years. Like, you should have a grip on that and be able to share that comfortably. Like, what your plans are in the next 5 years without somebody straight up asking what is your plan in the next 5 years?

Connell Barrett:

Got it. Because ambition, a vision, a goal, that's attractive. Right?

Lindsey Metselaar:

So attractive.

Connell Barrett:

Right. As opposed to, well, I don't know. Who knows what'll happen?

Lindsey Metselaar:

Yeah. I don't know. I hate being a lawyer.

Connell Barrett:

Okay. Next category is, let's say when a man approaches a woman at a bar, what do women want? What do women not want?

Lindsey Metselaar:

Women want something funny. Women always want to laugh. So leading with something that's gonna make her laugh is so crucial and women don't want the hey beautiful, hey sexy. Like, it's just it's too it sounds, like, sleazy even if that's not your intention. You know?

Connell Barrett:

So open with something funny. Do you have any memories, any examples, anecdotes

Lindsey Metselaar:

from Even just a simple, like, how does it feel to be the most, like, the most beautiful person here? Like, that's funnier than, hey, beautiful.

Connell Barrett:

Nice.

Lindsey Metselaar:

Like, I or, like, I feel bad for all these other girls because you're here. You know? Yeah. Like, what should we do about it?

Connell Barrett:

One of the funniest approaches I ever did, I was at a club in Vegas years ago, and I saw this woman who I ended up becoming and entering a relationship with. And all these guys were hitting on her with the whole, hey. You're hot. You're gorgeous. You're what you have. And I've been taking improv classes, so I was learning the art of just being a silly character.

Lindsey Metselaar:

Mhmm.

Connell Barrett:

And I unbuttoned my black button halfway down, and I just opened up my shirt. And I walked over to her and I said, hello. I and I adopted, like, a fake Latin lover accent. And I said, hello. I am Armando. And a skinny pale ginger like me saying that, it was just so dumb that she found it really funny. That's amazing. She called me Armando for the whole weekend.

Connell Barrett:

It was yeah.

Lindsey Metselaar:

That's really funny.

Connell Barrett:

Yeah. I think leading with humor and playfulness is better than being all sexy.

Lindsey Metselaar:

Always. Lean into the silly.

Connell Barrett:

Yeah. Good example. One more, one more category. A man's dating app profile from the woman's perspective. What do women want to see that might make them wanna swipe right, and what do they not want to see?

Lindsey Metselaar:

Women want to see, like, one tiny tidbit of vulnerability if that's like I'm in therapy or like kind of making something about your life into a funny prompt And women don't want to see gym selfies, selfies in general.

Connell Barrett:

Yeah.

Lindsey Metselaar:

And like pictures of you holding a fish.

Connell Barrett:

What is it about that?

Lindsey Metselaar:

Men just think that if they show a picture of them having caught a fish, then they're like, I'm a man. So you can trust that I'm a man now because I can catch a fish, and now you can swipe right.

Connell Barrett:

Right. The working title for my book was it's not you. It's the halibut you're holding. And it ended up being a throwaway line in

Lindsey Metselaar:

That's amazing.

Connell Barrett:

Online dating chapter. Yeah. I don't know. I guess I yeah. That's why men do it because they wanna show, oh, I'm a provider. Look what I need. I can bring home, instead of the bacon, I can bring home the mackerel.

Lindsey Metselaar:

Exactly. And then by the way, going back to what women do want to see, again, always humor, always humor. Like if I'm cracking up from your dating app profile, I'm saying yes, no matter what you look like.

Connell Barrett:

Okay. Do you remember any lines or or just, themes that made you laugh in the past? Things

Lindsey Metselaar:

There was a line once recently, it was very simple. I saw on a guy's dating profile that I was helping a girl with, and it said, believe it or not, I, which is like a hinge prompt.

Connell Barrett:

Okay.

Lindsey Metselaar:

Believe it or not, I took an Uber recently that was less than $50. And I just was just like a funny little Nice. And then there was another guy who recently had something. He said, all I ask is that you were the prompt. And he said, support Ben and Jen. Like, Ben Affleck and Jennifer Lopez. And I just thought it was silly. Like, I like when guys aren't afraid to lean into, like, a pop culture reference.

Connell Barrett:

Nice. Yeah. I like pop culture references. I remember I kind of fell a little bit in love once with a woman's profile on a dating app. I'd never even met her. I just love that we just matched, and I just instantly wanted to meet her or at least go on a date with her and see what happened. She wrote something like, I'm looking for a man on the street, but a dead body in the sheets.

Lindsey Metselaar:

And I love that.

Connell Barrett:

Think that's an allusion to a rap song, Jay z. I don't know. I think it was a rap song, but it was just a funny little rhyme, and it just made my soul smile. So That's

Lindsey Metselaar:

great. I love that.

Connell Barrett:

Alright. Let's wrap up with usually, I ask a guest for what I call the 3 game changing dating tips. Mhmm. But let's make it 4 today since your Instagram, you give a lot of fours. If you're

Lindsey Metselaar:

I love that. I love that personalization.

Connell Barrett:

Yes. Let's make it very Lindsay personalized. Four game changing dating tips for the man who's listening to this, anything you want, anything, fire away.

Lindsey Metselaar:

Yes. Okay. Number 1 is follow the rules. Meaning, We Met Acne has a set of rules for men to follow and for women to follow. Without getting too into them, I would say just like pay for the date if you ask her on the date, you know. Be a gentleman, open doors, don't ask to go up or invite her over after the first date. You know all of those kinds of things. Follow those rules.

Lindsey Metselaar:

Get her flowers. And I would say number 2 always has the next date set up. Women hate when we're in this sort of limbo where we're like when are we gonna see them again and like are we just gonna be you know pen pals now or are they gonna ask me out on that other next date, right? Even if they're not free for a week I still wanna have that next date planned. Number 3 is to initiate all of the things and don't be afraid to. Initiate the I love you, initiate the let's move in together, and initiate the will you be my wife if that comes up. You know Initiate all the things. Don't make her feel like she has to corner you to have these conversations. And number 4, which I didn't know we were gonna have a number 4, so give me a second.

Lindsey Metselaar:

Number 4, I would say, don't be afraid to be persistent which we talked about a little bit.

Connell Barrett:

Right.

Lindsey Metselaar:

But don't be afraid to be persistent because we're all gonna get rejected in life and it's like if you don't ask you won't get and so you never know what's going on in a person's life. Be persistent if you really really especially for men I feel like men just are luckier in this instance where like they can get away with it. So yeah. Get away with it. Be persistent and until you're creeping in on stalker territory, just be persistent.

Connell Barrett:

It's okay. As long as she's responsive.

Lindsey Metselaar:

Yeah.

Connell Barrett:

And or if she says, hey. Thanks, but no thanks. I'm not interested, obviously, and move on. The guy who's listening to this, he's very afraid of being seen as creepy or coming across as some kind of weirdo, which is coming from a beautiful place of not wanting to be a jerk.

Lindsey Metselaar:

Right.

Connell Barrett:

But your message seems to be, hey. It's okay to be a man who's going after what he wants with persistence as long as there's empathy, as long as you're noticing how she feels, and then Oh,

Lindsey Metselaar:

yeah.

Connell Barrett:

Play it as it comes. Right?

Lindsey Metselaar:

And I have to tell you for the persistent guy, when you stop being persistent, she'll miss that.

Connell Barrett:

Yeah. She

Lindsey Metselaar:

will. I know she will because my friend missed it, and now they're married with 2 kids.

Connell Barrett:

Nice. Nice. Yeah. I've had it, years ago, but I had a date from many moons ago when I asked her out a couple of times, and she finally said, okay. Yeah. I'm free on Friday. I just wanted to see how persistent you are. Happy face, winky face. Oh, I

Lindsey Metselaar:

I love that.

Connell Barrett:

Yeah. Persistence I say I like to say persistence combined with empathy with Mhmm. Noticing how she's feeling. And either way, you're so so you're never gonna be a creep as long as you're noticing how you're making a woman feel and you adjust accordingly.

Lindsey Metselaar:

Totally. Be persistent and self aware.

Connell Barrett:

That's a really good place to end the advice portion of today. Let's finish by telling us a little bit about some live shows and events you have coming up at the end of September or in September and also November. Tell us about We Met at ACME events, please.

Lindsey Metselaar:

Thank you. So we do these live events, some of which are mixers in New York City where, you know, men and women living in New York could meet each other which is really fun. And we do these live shows as well. We have one in LA, SF and Austin. So if you're in any of those places and all of that can be found on our website, we met at acne.com.

Connell Barrett:

Fantastic. I tried to stump you, Lindsay. I couldn't do it.

Lindsey Metselaar:

You have

Connell Barrett:

an answer for everything. I'm gonna retire the hairy leg pickup line that I started this year.

Lindsey Metselaar:

I honestly dare someone to try it. I would just love to hear how that goes.

Connell Barrett:

Thank you so much for coming on today. It was a blast, and I hope to have you back sometime down the road and see you at one of your events.

Lindsey Metselaar:

Would love to and would love that. Thank you so much.

Connell Barrett:

Alright. Peace out. Later, guys.